In this episode of Vital Psychedelic Conversations, Johanna interviews Daan Keiman, MA: Buddhist, Psychedelic Chaplain, and Co-Founder of the psychedelic think-and-practice tank, Communitas Collective Foundation; Aura Ahuvia: Rabbi who served five years as President of the ALEPH (Alliance for Jewish Renewal) Board and is now the Founder of Psychedelic Rabbi; and Josh Harper: Consciousness Medicine Guide who works with Ligare, a Christian Psychedelic Society.

They dig deep into the intersection of psychedelics and spirituality, focusing largely on the concept of psychedelic chaplaincy: how they each define it and how spiritual caregivers are uniquely positioned to be of service to those coming out of powerful and unexplainable mystical experiences (whether they be psychedelic or not). They discuss why being grounded in a spiritual tradition is important, but how it’s often more important to be open to mystery and exploring that which is complex and difficult, even if that means someone questioning if their religion is truly right for them anymore.

Each tell their stories of struggling with and eventually embracing their religion and how psychedelics and spirituality became part of their lives, and discuss much more: Psychedelics in religious history and the slow embrace of mysticism in today’s renaissance; the importance of truly listening to individuals’ experiences and not dismissing life-changing experiences as ‘drug-induced’; how practice (no matter what kind) is a huge benefit of religion; and the need to eventually de-center psychedelics from the narrative – that the shared experience of coming together in community and asking big questions is where the healing truly lies.

Notable Quotes

“My approach personally to working with people outside of my Jewish tradition is to know that on the one hand, I am grounded in my own tradition, but on the other hand, I carry it lightly into that space because I’m aware that our connection in that moment is going to be: We are two fellow humans and there is no need for that which grounds me to be that which grounds somebody else.” -Aura

“The vocation of the church is to see people healed and whole, but it seems like the church is more interested in defending its own version of the truth than to see the healing and wholeness of people. And for any Christian Pastors or leaders out there who are listening to this, it’s very likely that you will have people in your congregations who are coming to you with these experiences, and you have the opportunity to listen to them, regardless of your own personal feelings of psychedelics. You have the opportunity to listen, to welcome them in. And I believe that the church, with that kind of openness, can be a great place for integration.” -Josh

“I think it can become potentially harmful, especially in the long run, if we start to see these places where people can come kind of exist over time; if the only way we have access to this is because we’re going to take a psychedelic substance. And I think the sooner we de-center psychedelics, the less risk we have, thinking that it’s about the experiences, and the more we start to realize it’s about the relationships that we maintain. And it’s not about the shared religion, it’s not about the shared experience, it’s about the fact that, as humans, we come together and ask ourselves: What does it mean to be alive right now? And in asking it in a community, we’re also partly living that answer.” -Daan

Links

Communitas.cc

Psychedelicrabbi.com

Ligare.org: A Christian Psychedelic Society

Psychedelics Today: PT282 – Rabbi Zac Kamenetz & The Rev. Hunt Priest – Judaism, Christianity, and Embracing Psychedelics